11 replies to this topic

[Bot]

Hi all. Bocage has been very unbalanced recently. This is all anecdotal, but I’ve been playing far too much of this game lately and this is one of my favourite maps. The reg patch and a more populated server have really exacerbated these issues. I think now would be a good time to make a few changes to the map mods.

 

Originally Bocage was skewed to Allied, but with all the changes made I have not been able to win this map recently as Allied. Most of the time Allied is baselocked or barely able to hold/ contest the flag closest to their main. Here are a few reasons/ suggestions:

 

Sawmill flag location

I think one of the main reasons for the imbalance in this map is that the sawmill flag has been moved North from its original location inside the wood fence by the mill over to the edge of the ramp up from the river.

• When playing Allied, it is now almost impossible to grey/ cap the mid flag at that new location as inf. There is no real cover there, and you are totally exposed when Axis spawns in close to the mill and to sniper/ tank fire from the flag closest to the Axis base. You now need a tank to roll up to be able to cap this flag, and the tank has the same issues as the infantry as it’s exposed to fire from the flag North of the river, as well as grenades/ zooks from all the people spawning at the mill.
• It is now much easier to cap the sawmill flag when playing Axis, as all you need to do turn the flag grey is climb up from the ramp by the river and prone behind the berm. Parking the spawn APC on the river ramp is also basically a cheat code to cap this flag, as you then have 5-6 infs respawning pretty much on top of the flag.  A tank pushing this flag has cover from the first Allied flag due to map topography and the wooden fence.
• Suggestion: Return the sawmill flag back to its original location close the fence and mill. This would allow Allied to turn the flag grey from behind the fence, and might even make up for all the other balance issues/ decisions which skew to Axis’ favour.

Allied air power is lacking

If I remember right, this map was originally designed with Allied having an advantage in the air and Axis having more tanks to compensate. Now, Axis actually has the advantage in the air as well, and the allied Mustangs are not able to turn the game around for a few reasons:

• Axis gets 3 109s while Allied gets 2 Stangs and a B17. This gives Axis the advantage. No matter how OP the Mustang is it’s tough to win fights when you are outnumbered
• 109s are more multirole than the Stangs, and are better at bombing tanks/ flaks. Even 3 low skilled pilots can do good damage to the Allied tanks – which are now essential to capping the sawmill flag
• While fun, the b17 is hard to use in a ‘contested airspace’, and with 3 109s flying around it’s tough to stay alive long enough to do much. The B17 is also poor at killing tanks.
• Flak spawns super fast, and along with being limited to 15 bombs this means that you can no longer clear out all the flak and focus on bombing tanks. Overall, this makes it harder to turn a game around by air power alone
• Suggestion: The B17 is a sideshow; add one Mustang or remove one 109 to balance the fighters.

​​Axis spawn APC

• The spawn APC is a great addition to the game. On Bocage, it’s very useful to Axis in capping the mid flag, and the lack of a similar capability for Allied really harms them.
• Suggestion: Give Allied a spawn APC

 

Axis has a few other advantages on this map, such as skilled tankers preferring the P4 and Tiger; more cover and a shorter distance between their main and the first flag; and the flak at the flag closest to Allied main being able to hit into Allied main, but these seem to be a fair price to pay for the Allied advantages of an extra bridge and the Stang being massively OP in dogfights. I think the mods above are what are really hurting Allied here.

[Captain John H. Miller]

Hi Bot, thank you for your suggestions. I'll relay the above to the admin section and start a discussion there.

[Stamper]

If you add an extra Mustang...perhaps an MG42/Browning at the bridge flag sandbags? Then at the saw mill, add one at under the saw mill roof aiming towards the windmill and then also one on the AA sandbags.....

 

Might as well add another MG to the empty window in the windmill too, perhaps even the D7 house.

 

If none of these, I like the idea of allies having a spawn apc.  Could both sides each receive an additional APC? Both teams would have one spawn apc, one non-spawn apc...

 

I'll admit that a significant portion of my gameplay consists of forcing bails/shooting down planes from such weapons (in contrast to my years as a pilot...), so I confess my bias...

[Colonel Tavington]

_{Make other adjustments if need be but keep the B17 (it's not on a lot of maps).}

[COLONEL HESSLER]

Great points Bot! I totally agree with you

[Col Kilgore]

Allied should definitely have a spawn apc, or take away the axis one.

[Nicole]

I could always give the Axis Nerf guns instead of their current weapons!

[OWLCAT]

Submarines in the river please!

[CA1]

I brought up the allied APC that allows spawn earlier this year and they said it might unbalance the map due to allies having two ramps.  I still think it could strategically help with this map.  I love Bots suggests listed above.  

[Col Kilgore]

Submarines in the river please!

 

PT Boats! if anything it would be another thing to shoot planes with

[Ooby]

Late to this topic, but great points bot. I agree with all of them. 

I think moving the sawmill flag back to it's original position would certainly help much of the balance issues. It very difficult to capture that flag as allied infantry for the reasons you stated. 

Personally, I think the mustangs are too strong and should be swapped to spitfires. I'd prefer removing 1 of the BF109s instead of adding another allied plane. 

Actually adding the small boats that are found on Caen and Market Garden to the bridge flags could add an interesting dynamic to the map. I think it'd alleviate some of the infantry congestion on the bridges and disincentive the motorcubes of the world to use planes a taxi to the opposing bridge flag. 

 

[Jubilee]

I think moving the sawmill flag back to it's original position would certainly help much of the balance issues. It very difficult to capture that flag as allied infantry for the reasons you stated. 

 

The current position also makes it almost too easy to defend for snipers. Everyone lies down on just the edge of that hill to grey it, so go-getters become immediate immobile targets. All it takes is one bullet, and the flag is mine, all mine mwahahaha