Jump to content


Photo

Migration and You: What does it mean?


  • Please log in to reply
46 replies to this topic

#1 Enforcer

Posted 09 April 2015 - 02:13 PM

Well, the title says it all.  The question is this:

 

When we migrate the Arma 2 files to the new box/drive, should we migrate the existing database or shall we start with a clean slate?

 

The advantage is that we will not be carrying over ANY subtle lines of code that we did transfer over from our time with Survival Servers.  There is no telling what may be on there from that time.  Disadvantage..we have to rebuild...everything..fuel stations, NEAF protection, bases, everything. Advantage..lots of vehicles (copters) to find and make some serious cash.  Disadvantage..you will have to buy everything all over again.

 

Overall, the frame rate may improve as we can limit items on the map with the decay script.  We did not do that in the beginning, in fact, the bases were indestructible.  So, what is the consensus with regard to the issue at hand?

I have my opinion..what is yours?



#2 Warrior124

Posted 09 April 2015 - 04:32 PM

As much as I love my base I think we should start over fresh.



#3 TomKnollRFV

Posted 09 April 2015 - 06:08 PM

I advocate we get to keep stuff :( Because Some of us don't have TONS of things around. <Also it took me a week to build the Ark, plz don't make me do that again>

 

 

I actually was musing over this the last night or two..

 

Now the problem is the Frig all EVERY THING in place. I had a brilliant plan for this<Well i think it is>. Nuke every thing not active in the last week before the move over/whatever. All locked vehicles not 'actively' used in the last week, all bases. All hidden bases. All the mini bases people built for kicks. All of it but our main stuff gone. <For most of us, we just plain lack the massive stuff>.



#4 Enforcer

Posted 10 April 2015 - 09:04 AM

Tom, that would the same story for everyone.  NONE of us will have anything.  No one will have tons of stuff around.  It is a clean slate.  We all spawn in as a brand new player with nothing. 

 

The thought process is like this, and you really summed it up without realizing it.  To you, having tons of stuff is a positive.  For those that have tons of stuff, it is now almost a negative.  I'll explain as there are many in my same position.  The game is what you make of it.  It can be as easy or as hard as you want it to be. (For example: A green mesh with a DMR = Easy.  Same green mesh with an assault rifle = Harder.  Same green mesh mission with a shotgun = Much harder)  So, the game can be as hard or as easy as you want to make it.  But, once you have your materials, and you have built a base, killed 300 bandits, possess two or three of each gem possible, looted all the guns you can carry, purchased six or more vehicles what else is there to do?  The game gets stale when there is no work...no game.

 

I don't know who coined the phrase for the server but, Naked and Afraid is actually a very popular thing nowadays.  Why is that?  Because you have nothing and have to loot again to find stuff.  There is a reward for finding stuff, it occupies your time, and is more challenging as you have nothing.  It is even more difficult than a new spawn, because in naked and afraid, you drop all weapons.  A new spawn at least starts with a CCO and some bandages, a backpack and such.  N&A starts with nothing in your inventory..at all.  All of a sudden the Ai are something to worry about and turns out, they will kill you quickly if you can't get a bead on them with your double barrel shotgun that you found in a farmhouse.  When was the last time you used an Enfield and thought that was a step up from what you had before, only a pistol.  It adds risk to the game again.  I think it is that risk that makes the game even more enjoyable.  Plus the whole risk vs reward and the feeling of satisfaction when you can take a solid mission with a CCO.  THAT'S an accomplishment.  Anyone can do it with an AS50. 

 

That coupled with maybe a quicker, cleaner database is the argument for starting over with a clean slate.  We ALL will be starting over.  We all will help each other find what the other needs.  It promotes working together again, vs doing everything solo because you have all you need to lone wolf it. 

 

But these are just my thoughts on the matter.



#5 CrashMaster

Posted 10 April 2015 - 11:57 AM

Well ... it took me 6 months to get built up to where I have a good base since I can only play for short times, and I don't do missions.... so you know my vote =)



#6 TomKnollRFV

Posted 10 April 2015 - 12:36 PM

Some of us though have no motivation to rebuild over and over though Enforcer. I'm quite content having access to my myriad XM8 or G36 variants in my base, and flying around doing jack productive but talking to people and giving lifts and helping new players escape the coast.

 

 

I'm with Crash. Even though I have the time to rebuild and mission grind etc. I didn't find any of it fun. I find the fun bit of when I can go 'and now I need not worry about my armaments and vehicles and base, because I have all of it. Now its time to dick around and not worry if a M2 actually ends up blowing up my Black Hawk, because I'll get another'.

 

 

I've tried Naked and Afraid, me and Hollywood ended up on our own :P

 

Note; I think maybe we should consider letting people who WANT a restart, to opt to do so by voluntarily losing all their stuff. Since it seems the trend is those who have the megabases and monsterous piles of gold etc want the wipe. Those of us with out huge piles of stuff are like 'Noooo I dun wanna lose my meager posessions!' So maybe do a check with who'd voluntarily give things up? Maybe that'll solve the problem with out every one having to give things up... :P



#7 BOVA

Posted 10 April 2015 - 06:35 PM

.



#8 Randigar

Posted 10 April 2015 - 07:46 PM

I vote for a clean restart and as far as threats of people leaving well most of you guys know my opinion on threats :P



#9 Enforcer

Posted 10 April 2015 - 08:14 PM

Bova..if this was being shoved down your throat, there would have been no discussion on it.  Consider that if you feel yourself choking.

 

You want to play elsewhere..what exactly will that mean?  That will entail you starting over, just somewhere else.  And if that is your veiled threat, feel free to retreat to anywhere you choose to. 

 

Yes, we do not know for sure the server fps will get better, that is a hope but, we do not know.  We DO know what we have now and that it is almost non playable.  So, anything we could do to better that, I think should be considered.

 

If there is a reset, there is no "voluntarily" about it.  There is no save this but, not save that.  It would be a database cleansing.  I am simply offering a counter to Tom's opinion.  Make up your own mind and voice your opinion.  That is what this thread is all about.

 

Lastly, if you want to go elsewhere, please do so.  I, nor any other admin, is holding a gun to your head to stay here.  If you don't feel you belong, don't like the direction of Moongamers, don't like the way we carry ourselves in game, don't want to stay over the possibility of a wipe, then consider yourself excused.  Now I say that to say, I enjoy playing these games with you guys and would hate to see you leave, but, in the end, it really is your call.  Players come, players go.  I would think that over time, there would be some sense of loyalty to your community, our community.  If there is none, well, why here over anywhere else?

 

So, again, this is the place to voice an opinion, and I am not above the opinions of others.  I opened this thread for just that opinions.  If I didn't care to hear it, there would not be a thread.

 

Frankly, I am more against it than for it, however, I am also willing to forgo  my input in hopes of bettering the community offering when it comes to Dayz and maybe the fps does improve for some and in the end, that would be better to me, than losing my accumulated stuff.  This game is all about occupying my time with people I consider friends.  Not accumulating a wealth of pixels on a computer screen.



#10 Randigar

Posted 10 April 2015 - 08:37 PM

Ok guys so what you do not realize when people say I am rich in game is beyond what most of you realize, I have over 4000 hours on our server and have well over 500 bc and all my bases and over 50 safes I am willing to let it all go for the server not to mention how fun a fresh server restart is whith alot of players in at startup. Maybe for the players that wish we could say start you with 5bc so you can get a faster start. so anyways people vote on this as Craig is working on the new box so we can give him some direction as what and how to set it up.


  • Captain John H. Miller likes this

#11 Thirteen

Posted 11 April 2015 - 02:01 AM

When we reset the server the first time (I believe this is when we moved to Survival) I was upset that I didn't have the small stuff I had acumulated.  Because it was work to get to where I was.

 

But after a few weeks of playing with others getting stuff and finding heli's and stuff I found it rather fun.

 

I don't have as much time to play as I would like and even when I was building a base or two I didn't have the creative juices to do so.  I'd much rather find a small hole in a wall or a "couch" to crash on better.

 

I look at when we had the visitor that deleted all our vehicles and how much better the server ran after those vehicles were all gone.  If we got that with just a vehicle wipe, how much would a clean server with limits already in place to destroy (decay) things that are built but not in use.

 

I vote for a wipe.  I do understand the feelings of those who accumulated stuff and built stuff over a long period of time feeling like what's the point of building if there is always that threat of loosing the stuff you accumulate.



#12 Captain John H. Miller

Posted 11 April 2015 - 04:00 AM

My 2 cents, 

 

The last time we started over, we also had to builf out bases again. But we learned what could be improved and did it. This may be a new place to build a base or just as simple as rearrange your base. I didn't like it at first to start all over, but the pro's of building my whole base from scratch again was awsome. And everyone starts with 0, so it becomes a surviving game again. You dont have to start learning how the game works, you know everything already, it just makes starting all over again easier.



#13 TomKnollRFV

Posted 11 April 2015 - 12:33 PM

This notion of a reset turning this into a 'survival' game is a joke no matter what way you cut it.

 

DayZ's AI is easily avoided, and Zombie AI is..well zombies. At no point, is this reset making it about survival again. You can acquire a high powered gun inside of 15 mins, all the ammo you need, and be settling in to cutting apart Green Missions etc...

 

If you sat in TS3 etc, what I will label as your Normal player; IE not an admin, or some one with enough swag to fill a bank vault thrice over, doesn't like this -at all-.

 

On the other hand, some agreed with me if we had a militarized server, then a clean slate in the sense of moving to it would make sense. But alot of people who aren't admins are not in favour of this, and I think thats where Bova is alluding to shoving it down our throats Enforcer. I Mean the bulk of the players on the server -likely- aren't on the forums.



#14 Enforcer

Posted 11 April 2015 - 04:43 PM

If they are not of the forums, but, on teamspeak, they are missing the chance to voice their opinion.  They can certainly send me a message in teamspeak if they want, but, much of what we do is forum related.  So..

 

Funny thing Tom, you bring up those that are in teamspeak and regular players, but without much swag.  The way I am hearing it, the admins are all for a clean slate for the sake of the possible benefit of a clean database and an increased fps.  The players, who you mention, who are on teamspeak, but, not admin, are against it. 

 

Pretty telling I think..about who cares about the community, and who does not.



#15 TomKnollRFV

Posted 11 April 2015 - 04:56 PM

The thing is Enforcer.... the FPS issue, I don't really see it. I get the same FPS slow ups in offline Arma II etc. I don't get the consistent problems others do. So for me its some thing I'm having issues gauging, and as Bova said, it may not fix a thing, its a valid point, it may well not. Some people playing on your server have very dated systems, so they may never seen an improvement. 

 

 

I'm still against the clean slate because I just foresee within a week, every one back to where they were. As it is; I hear people on TS3 building mini bases all over. But I'm a jaded old gamer who has done stuff professional for MMO Firms. I just assume no matter what the worse case happens. <Because for most game situations when you professionally are a CSR, you do see the worst case scenario. I mean come on, its why they paid us to do things, worst case idiocy required us :P>

 

 

Also This maaay be a wild idea; but that PVP server never has any one on it..maybe we could you know, keep our bases on it? ;)



#16 Lin

Posted 12 April 2015 - 05:06 PM

Hi Tom.

 

You weren't here in the days of the 18,000+ object database and frame-by-frame gameplay, either. And, after we had reduced the objects to 10,000, you weren't here for the hacker who wiped every blessed vehicle off the map. If we could find him we would shake his hand, because we reduced our overall vehicle count based on that event and that, too, increased the FPS and provided better gameplay.

 

There is a reason why we feel we are being wiser in taking a more forward-thinking stance. We have spent hours learning the game, how the server reacts, and bringing the server to a more playable state.

 

The PvP server is down, I believe, until we get everything moved over to the new box. After that I heard there are still plans to expand the ARMA2 selection a bit.

 

I'm not confirming that a wipe is going to happen; that is just the rumor right now and I have not heard that a final decision has been made. We'll make an announcement if it is.



#17 Enforcer

Posted 13 April 2015 - 12:39 PM

Look bottom line for me is this: I don't want to have to rebuild my main base for the third time, and the treehouse all over again.  I don't want to have to build the cinderwall at NEAF protecting all players while they trade from AI all over again.  All the fuel pumps at all the stations..the PvA base, that we JUST finished this weekend.  But, I will, if I thought we could get an fps object count increase.  For me, it is NOT my machine.  I can run Arma 2 offline at the max settings just fine.  But, when I get on our online server, I get the lag.  Like I said, I am for it, only if there is a benefit for the server as a whole. 

 

Hell, the vehicle count alone was worth the hacking done.  Sure, people lost things, in the way of keys, weapons, gems etc.  We had to go out, make some gold and buy them all over again.  It was a Db administrators nightmare...everyone needing a master key all over again, which was why I went to the Tues, Thurs, and Sat rule.  So, I could actually game on the other nights.  But, you know what..I think people had a blast finding all those helicopters, and such, and the benefit was..all those BS ladas that were all over the place that the kiddies were buying and leaving were now gone.   And you should have seen hero trader that weekend, we needed ATC to control all the inbound aircraft.

 

But, you are correct, it won't take some very long at all to have the places completely rebuilt.  Others start with a tent and some walls, and go from there.  Others, like Randigar who have much time than most of us, will be rebuilt inside of two days.  In the end, we'll do what people vote for and the majority will rule the day.

 

Right now..is the time to voice your opinion one way or the other.



#18 TomKnollRFV

Posted 13 April 2015 - 01:26 PM

You know I'm curious, I played on Wasteland Arma II alot..and not in a mean way, even Randigar's base doesn't hold a candle to what those things looked like base wise. So I'm curious; what is the difference between Wasteland and DayZ for building stuff? I mean there must be some thing as Wasteland Servers will peak at 50+ Players, and we've had multiple bases up at once 3x larger then Randigar, and the vehicle count is massive too. <For instance, on the one I was playing on, at one point, we actually had -30- T90s hidden and rolled them out at once>.

 

I'm against it, but thats just because I'm still going 'But I'm still new here!' and my priorities are different then some perhaps. In a way I feel more bad for the new players I've helped if they end up -just- getting their base up etc and a clean slate rolls around.

 

Though me and Jimbo both been discussing this; any chance the Clean Wipe will roll around when the militarized server comes out? I mean some of us wouldn't be so out of sorts and all. Sure, clean wipe hits..but new server for us to be on and that means the clean wipe isn't an issue.

 

As an aside, Chris brought this up; could we bring one inventory of stuff with? I'm thinking alot of us would bring chainsaws and fuel to expediate basic building. I sure would. Lord I sure would  lol.



#19 Thirteen

Posted 13 April 2015 - 03:13 PM

The whole point of a brand new database or fresh database is just that, no items from the old will port over.  As far as Admin's respawning inventory for players... That would be a logistical nightmare, and really not fair to the admins who also would have to rebuild their stuff.  Other than community items such as a generator, box, and jerrycan's at the fuel stations and maybe the wall at NEAF, Admins don't spawn in thier stuff. They earn it just like every other player.  That is pretty much a rule here.  I know Enforcer and LIn watch the admin spawned items and watch admins to make sure they are not abusing their powers.  Not to mention not all admins can spawn in all things.

 

So admins will be in the same boat as players and until they get to a point where they want to be in the game, gifting new players with vehicles and some spending cash will cease. Becuase admins and players will be in the same boat.

 

I suggest just so you can see the fun of starting from scratch, players try the fig leaf (naked and afraid) game with in the server.  Just empty your back pack and gear into a safe (make sure your backpack is empty not just in the safe full as a restart will wipe it.) put all your gear in there and type "/killme" You'll suicide and end up on the coast.  You can keep the starter gear and see how much you can get, or head to the water and dump all your gear again so you are completely bare of equipment and see how you fare.

 

It's actually fun to engage the game that way.I just started a new character over and am building a base as if I was starting fresh on the server. I am enjoying it as well.

 

What ever the decision will be, I am sure there will be some that will hate it.  As I hated it the first time I dealt with it.  But I learned it wasn't all that bad.

 

Cheers,

 

13



#20 Enforcer

Posted 13 April 2015 - 05:47 PM

Ah. we keep rehashing the idea between the same people.  For the record:

 

Tom: Votes no to clean slate.  Got it down.  Thank you for your time and input on this subject.

JimboJohn: Also votes no to clean slate.  By the sound of it.  Got it. 




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

Skin Designed By Evanescence at IBSkin.com